Spooktacular Origins: Unmasking the History of Halloween
From ancient traditions to modern-day festivities. Unearth the origins of jack-o'-lanterns, costumes, and the spooky tales that haunt this celebrated night. In this episode we talk about the history of how one of our favorite holidays came to be.
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Transcript
Welcome to this episode of horrific history and hauntings. I'm Beth.
Ramie:And I'm Ramie. We're your hosts, here to talk about the stories that the history books ignore.
Beth:From horrific epidemics and ghostly hauntings to the catastrophes and tragic events that have sickened humanity.
Ramie:Okay, what are we talking about today?
Beth:We're gonna be talking about the history of Halloween.
Ramie:Oh.
Beth:Because this will be coming out by the time it's October.
Ramie:That makes sense.
Beth:And I'm going to try to make it more spooky, ghostly things. But I decided on the history of Halloween for this one, and I got most of this information from a book I had on Kindle Unlimited.
You can read it for free if you have Kindle unlimited, or you can purchase it from Amazon for 524. It is called a history of the origins and traditions from Samhain to. To the modern day by Louisa Tarver.
Ramie:Okay, that sounds like a book you'd find in Hogwarts library.
Beth:Yes. But as I said in the last episode, I'm going to try to start doing the what happened today in history.
,: Ramie:Tylenol is what keeps the working man going.
Beth: ,: Ramie:Baba Yar.
Beth:I don't know Babiyar, and I'm assuming that it's german because it's about nazis. It was located on the outskirts of Kievan Kyiv.
Ramie:You've heard that in the news a lot lately.
Beth:Ukraine.
Ramie:Yes.
Beth:It was occupied by the Nazis at the time. And on September 19, the german army took Kyiv.
SS squads prepared to carry out Adolf Hitler's orders to exterminate all Jews and soviet officials found there. On September 29, more than 30,000 Jews were marched in small groups to Babiyar, Babiyar ravine to the north of the city.
They were ordered to strip naked, and then they were gunned down with machine guns into the ravine. On September 30, the massacre ended. Both dead and wounded were covered with dirt and rocks.
But between:As german armies retreated from the USSR, the Nazis attempted to hide evidence by exhuming bodies and burning them on large pyres.
Ramie:That must have been time consuming.
Beth:Yeah. They shouldn't have been doing what they were doing to try to hide it in the first place.
Ramie:No, but I wonder if the people that had to dig them up and burn them were the same people ended up shooting in the first place, or if everybody been moved around since then.
Beth:I don't know.
Ramie:It's awful.
Beth:Yeah, but that's our fun little. It's not fun, but our little. What happened today in history. Now we're going into the history of Halloween. More light.
An interesting little fact about Halloween. The name Halloween is thought to come from a scottish term for all Hallows Eve. And I believe that to be true.
Ramie:Because I've always heard it.
Beth: n can be traced back at least: Ramie:I don't know, Beth.
Beth:The pronunciation part is spelled s a h w h e n. Sawin Samhaindeh.
Ramie:Probably heard it and we're not saying it right. So I don't recognize it.
Beth: rigins of Sawin trace back to:It marks the end of the harvest season and the beginning of winter. The coming of winter was a big deal to the Celts because they relied heavily on the land for food and a bad harvest.
And a cold winter could mean starvation, therefore death. It was the time when Celts would take stocks of supplies and prepare for the cold months.
They would slaughter their livestock and preserve the meat for winter. Okay, poor livestock.
Ramie:Yeah, it had to be done then, I guess.
Beth:Yeah, it had to be done. It was thought to have originated in Ireland, then brought to other parts of Europe, but I'm not sure about that.
That's what it said, so that's what I put offerings and sacrifices to gods for favorable weather and good harvests were common in many cultures before they even came to Ireland. Festivities started on October 31, but Samhain is on November 1, when the festivities would end after dark.
Samhain was celebrated on the last day of the celtic calendar, which happened to be October 31.
It's believed that ghosts and other supernatural creatures could pass from their world and into the world of the living, and they could destroy crops and cause harm to people. And they also believed the veil between the two worlds was at its thinnest during that time, and that's how they were able to do this.
Communications with the dead was also thought to be possible during this time spirits of the dead would come knocking on the door for a warm welcome and a hot meal. And if they were not welcomed, they would cause mischief.
And this is why it was important to offer food and drinks to travelers who came to your door during that time. Well, nowadays you get murdered, you have.
Ramie:To invite strangers into your house or robbed. The greek gods, they were all about hospitality. And Zeus had a habit of traveling around and trying to get help from people.
And if they didn't help him, he would just make their life miserable or worse.
Beth:It's like the beauty and the beast, the old lady. But he was a child and he just didn't let her. A stranger in.
Ramie:Yep, that's what it is.
Beth:And she cursed him. To ward off evil spirits, people would eat special foods, such as roasted apples and cider.
Ramie:Oh, golly, don't. Don't make me eat the roasted apples and cider. Oh, I hate this time of year.
Beth:They would build bonfires and engage in rituals to honor their ancestors. And they would dress in costumes made of animal skins.
Ramie:That sounds.
Beth:And some sources said animal heads as well.
Ramie:Oh, why not? You got the skin. You might as well add the rest.
Beth:Yeah. Bonfires were not only to ward off evil spirits. It was also thought to help guide the souls of the dead back to the other world.
And the word bonfire comes from the words bone and fire, because people used to throw bones of slaughtered animals on the fires as a sacrifice to the celtic gods.
Ramie:They also burn really well when they're dry, so if you need some to burn better. Also, there's a local restaurant called the bone fire they.
Beth:I don't know about now because I've only actually been there once and I never ate anything. But they used to put a lot of alcohol in mixed drinks.
Ramie:I don't know about that. I do know that their food was pretty good when I went.
Beth:It smelled good. I never actually ate there, but it.
Ramie:Smelled good, like big barbecue stuff.
Beth:I just went to the bar or smoked stuff.
Ramie:I really don't know. It was really good.
Beth:It was also possibly meant to honor the sun God. And they believed the sun was dying during this time of year and that they were giving the sun the strength it needed to make it through the winter.
Ramie:He needs a ritual infusion.
Beth:How do you know it's not a she?
Ramie:They need a ritual infusion.
Beth:Archaeological evidence has been found at sites such as Stonehenge, of huge bonfires and feasts perhaps being held as part of this festival.
Ramie:Huh. I could see it. It looks like a perfect place for a bonfire. Or bonfire.
Beth:Mm hmm. It does. It was round. Samhain was originally a pagan festival, but was later adopted by the early christian church. And why, you ask?
Ramie:It's because they wanted to get these other people in their religion pretty quick.
Beth:In an attempt to become the dominant religion and to replace it with all Saints day.
Ramie:Yep. It worked. The religion of the west.
Beth:Yeah. The Romans helped influence Halloween.
After conquering the Celts, they brought in their own traditions, such as the festival of Pomana, a festival to honor the roman goddess Pomana.
Ramie:What is she a goddess of?
Beth:She is the goddess of fruit and trees. She's responsible for the fruitfulness of the trees and fertility. Apparently.
Originally, this festival was held in August, and it's also closely associated with apples because it's thought to be where the tradition of bobbing for apples came from.
Ramie:In the time before antibacterial soap and all that. I would not want to be sticking my head.
Beth:I go more fat of water. Yes. I go more into the bobbing for apples in a little bit, and I will state my own opinion on that.
Ramie:Okay.
Beth:Um, because. Yes, that's gross. F e r a l I a. Festival Feralia. That's actually kind of pretty, if that's how it's pronounced. It's dedicated to the dead.
Ramie:Oh.
Beth:People would make offerings to their deceased loved ones. They would like bonfires to ward off evil spirits, because apparently that's what bonfires do. It seems with all of these.
Now I'm going to go into the Christianity influence. Many pagan festivals were christianized and incorporated into existing christian holidays.
I'm going to try my best to not be offensive about this, but I'm just stating what I found when I did the research. That's it. Some of these holidays, obviously, was samhain and pomona. Pomona.
The 8th century pope gregory, in the book, there was two different ones, so I don't know which one it was, so I put both.
It said the third or the fifth in different parts, but whichever one it was, he moved the date of All Saints holiday from May 13 to November 1, which was likely to christianize the.
Ramie:Festival, make it the same festival, but put it in a different place and.
Beth:Under a different name and give it a whole different meaning.
Ramie:But people love it as long as they keep drinking and having their bone virus.
Beth:All Saints Day, also known as All Hallows Day, is dedicated to remembering saints who passed away. And All Souls Day was to honor all deceased christians. And that one is celebrated on November 2.
It's thought that All Saints Day and All Souls Day were combined to create all hell hallows Eve, which became Halloween.
Over time and as Christianity spread throughout Europe, the church attempted to replace pagan festivals with christian holidays by co opting existing pagan celebrations and giving them new meanings.
Ramie:The common folk just want to have their parties, and if we just name it what we want, it's still christian.
Beth:Yeah. Now into the history of trick or treating, Halloween became more widespread with Tom.
And in the 19th century, people began to dress up in costumes and go door to door and ask for food and money.
Ramie:People do that now?
Beth:Yeah. Immigrants from Ireland and Scotland brought their Halloween traditions to the United States, such as playing pranks, ghost stories and the costumes.
When it came to the Samhain festival, Celts would wear costumes made of animal skins to ward off evil spirits. They would also offer food and drinks to the spirits in hopes that they would leave them alone.
And then there's this thing called souling, where poor people would go door to door on all Souls day and would offer prayers for the dead in exchange for soul cakes. So people would leave these soul cakes out for the soul ers to enjoy.
Ramie:Just don't take more than one, please.
Beth:There's also a thing called mumming.
Ramie:I've heard of that.
Beth:It's likely another likely origin of trick or treating. It can be traced back to the middle ages.
Groups of people would dress in costumes and go house to house to perform songs and dance in exchange for food and money. And this likely evolved from an earlier tradition called mumming play, where actors would dress up as characters from history or mythology.
And the Celtics mummers were believed to ward off evil spirits.
Ramie:I remember I probably heard it many places and that's why it sticks in my head when I hear the word otherwise. I'd never remember it. I just think he was saying mummy.
Beth:That's what I thought. I thought it was a typo and they meant mummy, but it wasn't.
Ramie:That's where I watched too much BBC.
Beth:They were seen as supernatural beings. To some, that could bring good luck as well.
Ramie:Mummers. Yes, supernatural beings.
Beth:That's what it said. I don't see how that came out of it, but apparently that's.
Ramie:I wonder if that's where I heard it.
Beth:Philadelphia has a traditional mummer's festival and parade.
Ramie:Oh, that's nice.
Beth:Just a fun little fact for that. Since around the 16th century, Geising has been associated with Halloween.
Geising is going door to door in costumes and receiving food or money in return for singing or telling jokes. And this is thought to have come from Scotland. It's originally called Goloshians. Eventually it spread to Ireland and the rest of the United Kingdom.
And the earliest known reference to Geising dates back to medieval Scotland. It was traditional at the time for the poor to beg for food on holidays.
Ramie:It's traditional for them to do it all the time now.
Beth:Yeah, you kind of gotta eat even if you're poor or not. That survive. Should be a human, right.
Ramie:I found out where I heard the memory so much when Lestat, in his book, Lestat, vampire Lestat was his origin story. When he first gave the theater of the vampires the theater to do their vampiring they lived in the catacombs until then. He said.
They said, what are we to do with this? If you give it to us? He said, live in a normal life. Don't just be crazy. Cemetery people become mummers. And they did.
That's how they started the theater. Vampires. So that's where I've probably heard mummers so many times. I've read the book so many times. I just. I knew what it meant when I heard it.
Then hearing you say it, I'm like, well, that's probably the second time I've ever heard it in any other context.
Beth:Geising may also be linked to souling and mumming. And that makes sense to me because they all kind of sound the same.
These traditions made their way to the United States with the irish and scottish immigrants. Now we're going into Guy Fawkes. It's celebrated on November 5 and I hope that I pronounced it right.
Ramie:Okay. Yeah. Fawkes. Remember. Remember the 5 November? The gunpowder treason and plot. I know of no reason why the gunpowder treason should ever be forgotten.
Beth:Oh, is that where that come from?
Ramie:Yeah, that's who he was pretending to be.
Beth: lure of the gunpowder plot of:They would light bonfires and set off fireworks and children would go around begging for a penny for the guy.
Ramie:Yeah. He was gonna blow up parliament, wasn't he?
Beth:Yeah. There's also mischief night, which they might be the same thing. It's celebrated on November 4.
It's thought to have come about to commemorate the mischief that Guy Fawkes had been up to on the 4 November. It was the night before he was arrested for his plot to blow up parliament.
It's actually an older tradition that was originally celebrated in May which makes me think of April fools. This is not making me think of Halloween.
If it was in May, people would play pranks and tricks on other people which may be where the trick part of trick or treating came from.
Ramie:Mm hmm.
Beth:I don't like tricks. I'm a sour puss when it comes to something. Well, most tricks, I don't like them.
n North America in either the: Ramie:Get real active.
Beth: Yeah. In the: Ramie:Treat of, like, little puppies.
Beth:This was probably due to american tv shows and movies, which began to portray Halloween as a holiday centered around mischief. And candy still is. Yeah.
Ramie:Haunted houses and stuff like that. I guess that's just another type of mischief. You spook people and you get paid to do it.
Beth:Yeah. Now I'm gonna go into costumes, and I'm gonna. If you haven't noticed, a lot of this has to do with samhain, the first festival.
And they have a lot of similarities.
So it's gonna sound like I'm repeating a lot, but it's kind of important to repeat them because it kind of fits in with all of these little subtopics. In the past, people wore costumes to disguise themselves from evil spirits. Now they dress up for the fun of it and to scare people. Boo.
Celts would dress up in animal skins to disguise themselves.
Ramie:We know that part.
Beth:Yeah.
The idea of dressing up in costumes is said to have come from the idea that ghosts would take over the bodies of humans and therefore disguising as animals would protect them, or so they thought. And that leads eventually to dressing up as ghouls, goblins, monsters, and ghosts.
They thought that maybe these supernatural beings would not bother you if they thought that you were one of them.
Ramie:It works against the Sanderson sisters the first time.
Beth:The festival of Pomona. Dressing in costumes may have been influenced by the roman festival of Pomona, the goddess of fruits and trees, if you remember.
People would dress in leaves and other plant based materials to celebrate. So you dress up like poison ivy?
Ramie:No, thank you. I'm not dressing up as poison ivy.
Beth:Or in poison ivy. I would certainly look monstrous after that, uh, dense macrobae.
Ramie:Macabre.
Beth:Macabre.
Ramie:Dance macabre. Beth.
Beth:Danse macabre. I don't know medieval talk.
Ramie:It's macrobae. It's like macrobae. If you want to do the knitting thing to make baskets. Dance Macrobay.
Beth:It's a medieval dance.
Ramie:It's dance macabre.
Beth:Dance. Macabre. Medieval dance. People would dress up as skeletons or the dead. It was a way to remember the fragility of life. And it also said to mock death.
But that doesn't make sense to me. Maybe it was.
Ramie:But you grimy Grimmy.
Beth:It likely came from the black death.
Ramie:That was a serious one.
Beth:Yeah. Which I'm gonna say here. I'm not gonna go into a lot of detail about the Black Death because you should go listen to our Pavelia island episode.
We have a lot of information about the black Death and some ridiculously hilarious treatments they tried.
Ramie:Also some crimes against humanity.
Beth:Yes, but it's our most popular episode.
Ramie:And our first.
Beth:And our first because I guess people.
Ramie:Just one hit wonders.
Beth:Yeah, but the only thing I'm gonna say about the black Death, you probably already know. It killed millions of people in Europe in the 14th century.
Ramie:Like one third of Europe.
Beth:Yes.
Ramie:I like the artwork they painted back then.
Beth:Yes.
Ramie:Like people dancing in one third of the population in the dancing crowd is corpse.
Beth:It's thought to be a way of coping with death caused by the black death. It was popular in France and other parts of Europe.
Ramie:That explains the pronunciation.
Beth:Mumming and geising, which dates back to the 16th century, is also believed to have an influence on costumes on Halloween.
Ramie:Why wouldn't it? I mean, it's literally the same thing.
Beth:Yeah. Dressing up in America was brought over by the irish and scottish immigrants in the 19th century.
The first people would dress in simple costumes using materials that they could find easily at home, like bed sheets. You just ruin your mama's bed sheets by poking holes in them. 19th century Halloween became more commercialized.
Costumes became more elaborate, and people started to purchase ready made costumes from shops, making life easier. More expensive, but easier.
Ramie:We did a lot, but we also occasionally had some we mashed together ourselves.
Beth:Yeah. A popular trend at the time was dressing up as famous people or fictional characters, which, that's a, to me, still a thing.
Ramie:Remember all the pirates when pirates of the Caribbean was coming out?
Beth:Yeah. I dressed up as a pirate around that time.
Ramie:I liked the stuff we see at the Mothman festival. Just cosplay.
Beth:Yeah.
Ramie:Mike called it a Halloween party.
Beth:In the 20th century, costumes became more reflective of pop culture trends. Movie stars and cartoon character costumes became more popular. There was an increase in adults dressing as children's books characters.
Cat in the hat.
Ramie:Ah, that's a popular one. But you don't see it very often. Usually it's the really tall people or the really short people in crowds, and then you use the hats to look taller.
Beth:Pumpkin carping originated in Ireland in the 18th century. There was an irish folk tale about a man named s t I n g y. Is that stingy or stingy?
Ramie:I'd call it Stingy Jack.
Beth:Stingy.
Ramie:Stingy Jack. I mean, he's stingy.
Beth:He was a drunkard. And he always played tricks on people and was causing mischief.
Ramie:Okay.
Beth:And he tricked the devil into climbing a tree. One day, when the devil reached the top of the tree, Jack carved a cross into the tree's trunk, which trapped the devil.
Ramie:If that was the easiest thing to do in the world, why does it take a war in the heavens to get him?
Beth:The devil promised not to claim Jack's soul when he died in exchange for his freedom.
Ramie:So even if he's been really naughty, he can.
Beth:He could pretty much do whatever he liked, I guess. So Jack managed to trick the devil two more times after that. And each time, the devil made the promise that he would not claim his soul.
I don't know why he wouldn't ask for something different.
Ramie:I don't die.
Beth:Yeah.
Ramie:Maybe that's a promise even he can't give.
Beth:Yeah. I feel like I would be like, ask him for money or something those other two times. Cause you're already safe from your soul getting taken.
Ramie:Yeah.
Beth:Eventually, the day came for Jack to die. But he was denied into heaven and ended up at the gates of hell. The devil denied him, as promised, as well.
Eventually, Jack made another deal with the devil. He said he would go away and leave him alone if the devil would give him a piece of coal to light his way through the darkness.
Ramie:Whoever said the devil didn't bargain?
Beth:The devil agreed and gave him a burning ember. And Jack put the ember in a carved out turnip. And then he left.
The story says he has been roaming earth ever since, using this glowing, carved out turnip to light his way.
Ramie:You were too young to remember, but I used to keep a turnip as a pet. As a child, I would travel around and treat it like a baby or a person. I don't remember. Mama tells me about it.
And I've got pictures of me, of my turnips. And they would occasionally throw the old one out and get me a new one. And if you know turnips, they last a long time.
So I must have had it for a long time. And then I had another one and didn't know it. So I could just be the reincarnation or the immortal.
Beth:You're Jack.
Ramie:Yeah.
Beth:Well, how about we're broke? So why don't you ask for some money instead of going?
Ramie:I've clearly been in this world far too long and forgotten my origins. So I won't remember anything until the next go around.
Beth:Okay.
Ramie:Or the next deal making. I don't know.
Beth:I never see turnips.
Ramie:It's on Facebook.
Beth:Oh, okay. That's why I don't see turnips. Interesting.
Ramie:I bought something to plant and they never grew. I ground hog ate all of them.
Beth:The name Jack O'Lantern, it came from Jack.
Ramie:Yeah, I kind of assumed.
Beth:Yeah. The Irish began calling the ghostly figure Jack of the lantern, which eventually became Jack O lantern.
Ramie:Yeah.
Beth:Some versions of the story say that Jack is collecting souls to take to hell with him, but I don't see how that makes sense if he's not.
Ramie:Allowed in hell buying his own soul. That's the only reason I could see him doing it.
Beth:And carved pumpkins are put on doorsteps in an attempt to scare away evil spirits.
Because when the Irish came to the United States, they realized that there were more pumpkins than turnips and that they were easier to carve than a turnip.
Ramie:Yeah, turnips are. They're not hollow like a pumpkin.
Beth:Now I'm gonna talk about will o wisps.
Ramie:First time I ever encountered a will o wisp, I was playing the elder scrolls, or oblivion.
Beth:A legend of stingy Jack. And the Jack O'lantern was probably influenced by this irish legend known as Will O wisps.
Will o wisps are ghostly lights that are said to haunt the bogs and marshes. They are thought to lure people into their doom.
Ramie:They certainly do me quite a lot in cyrodiil.
Beth:Well, just stop following them.
Ramie:I didn't follow them.
You hear this little whistle sound, and then something teleports right in front of you, and it's like two glowing orbs that with dust around it that's gold and then floating.
Beth:That's because it is dust.
Ramie:And then it electrocutes you and your health just drops away. Yep, that's how it would go.
Beth:Well, watch out for the dusty lights.
Ramie:They're cool. They're some of my favorite critter things. Also, you could call them aliens. In today, it's swamp gas.
Beth:They're said to be souls of sinners who were denied entry into heaven.
Ramie:Well, they must not have sinned enough to go to hell.
Beth:Yeah. The legend says many travelers have gotten lost in the wilderness while following these lights.
Some say the lights are the ghosts of travelers who die trying to find their way out of the marshes. Others believe they are fairies or other mischievous spirits.
Ramie:See, they show up as fairies in a lot of my stuff, too.
Beth:Yeah. A wisp is a torch, by the way.
Ramie:Is that what wisp means, Will?
Beth:A wisps translates into will of the torch.
Ramie:You are under the will of the torch, not your own.
Beth:It also says that Will was a wicked blacksmith who worked hard during the day but was always up to no good and causing mischief at night. And when he died, he was condemned to wander earth for eternity.
Ramie:Bad guy.
Beth:The devil would give him a single coal to light his way. And Will used the coal to lure people in.
And they're said to be found all over the world and are known by names such as pixielites, fairy fire, and fool's fire.
Ramie:Fairy fire. That's a d and D spell. I think there's a foxfire in Inuyasha.
Beth:There is. It's blue.
Ramie:Mm hmm.
Beth:I don't think it actually burns. It protects, if I'm not mistaken.
Ramie:Or makes his magic work.
Beth:Yeah. Cute little fox. There's another irish legend. The puka, I think is what you say. That p u c a.
It's a mischievous spirit that takes the form of an animal. It's usually a horse with glowing eyes. It's said to haunt bogs and marshes and lures travelers off the path to lead them to danger.
Believed to spoil fruit and play tricks on people during this time of year as well.
Ramie:Cool monsters.
Beth:Yeah.
Ramie:Critters. I don't know. Undead pony.
Beth:I would follow the pony. Halloween. In Mexico, the day of the dead, it's celebrated from October 1 to November 2.
And I have no idea how to pronounce this because I don't know Spanish. I did not do well in middle school when they forced us to take that class for a little while.
Ramie:Dia de moltes.
Beth:Yeah, what he said.
Ramie:Or el di de los.
Beth:Well, there you go. I'm not even gonna try to. People build altars to remember their loved ones who had passed away.
They also lit candles and bonfires to guide the souls of the dead back to the other world. Not only was it associated with Samhain, but was influenced by the british celebration of Guy Fawkes night.
And it's still celebrated by lighting bonfires and fireworks. And they will have traditional foods like toffee apples and roasted chestnuts.
People visit cemeteries and decorate graves with marigolds and other offerings. And marigolds are thought to help guide lost souls to find their way back to their resting place after they have visited their families.
For it's a celebration, and it's believed their punch and smell is what guides the spirits they symbolize the beauty and fragility of life.
Ramie:That's cute.
Beth:Yep. Adorable.
It's common for people to wear skeleton masks and costumes during the day of the dead celebration because, you know, the sugar skulls, you'll eat those too.
And an article on history.com says, according to the tradition, the gates of heaven are opened at midnight on October 31 and the spirits of the children can rejoin their families for 24 hours. The spirits of the adults can do the same on November 2.
Ramie:They have a cue.
Beth:And I can't help but think of the Halloween tree because that was actually my inspiration for the history of Halloween.
Ramie:It is a fun little cartoon. If you haven't watched it, it's also a book.
Beth:I didn't know it was a book.
Ramie:Yeah, it's a book. I'll add the link to that one. I'll also add the movie, of course. It's a nice little cartoon.
It kind of takes these guys trying to save their friend and they get guy who has a pumpkin tree and takes him through history and teaches him about parts of Halloween because he's.
Beth:Why they're dressed up.
Ramie:Yeah, why they're dressed up like they are mummies, ghosts, gargoyles. It's cool.
Beth:It's a great movie, even if it.
Ramie:Ain'T completely historically accurate. Obviously it is nice. You go start at Egypt and move your way up. Time.
Beth: y of the Dead goes back about:After a person died, they were believed to travel to the land of the dead or the otherworld.
And it was believed that they would only reach their final resting place after a journey of several years while completing nine challenges along the way. And I tried to look up what these challenges were, but I couldn't find anything.
Ramie:Can you imagine being one of the few people in this era that lived to be the ripe old age and laying there on your deathbed like, I'm just so tired. It's happening. I'm going to get some rest and you have to remember, oh, I got to go on a years long walk.
Beth:No, I'll just stay here. Thank you. In Asia, their version of Halloween is called Ting chi.
Ramie:I think that's right.
Beth:It's also known as the festival of Hungry Ghosts. It's believed on this day spirits can roam freely among the living.
And to appease these spirits, people offer them food and burn paper money so that they can use it in the afterlife.
Ramie:We see that in a lot of anime on and off. Or maybe there's a talismanism type things they're burning. Is this all of Asia that does this?
Beth:Like, I think it's just China.
Ramie:Okay.
Beth:But I'm not sure it said Asia in the book, but it mentions China. It says celebrated either on the 14th or 15th day, depending on where you are located in China. So I'm assuming it's just China.
Ramie:Okay. Because it makes sense with the name.
Beth:Yeah. It's of the 7th month of the lunar year. I don't know when that is because I don't know what that is.
But meals are prepared three times and plates are. And settings are set out for the ancestors.
They burn incense and they write their ancestors names on paper lanterns and place them in the river so they'll float down the river.
Ramie:We have seen that in anime also. We have seen these ancestors in Mulan, the cartoon.
Beth:They believe the ghosts will follow the lanterns away towards their own realm.
Ramie:Just out to sea.
Beth:Yeah.
Ramie:Okay.
Beth:That's where most rivers go when it comes to parties. People would celebrate Halloween by having mischief night parties.
Ramie:That sounds like some sort of fetish.
Beth:It was originally part of the May festival, but was moved to November 4 in the United Kingdom, October 30. For the United States, it's a night to play pranks on friends and neighbors.
And these parties usually became rowdy and would sometimes end in property damage and vandalism.
Ramie:That still happens.
Beth:Yeah.
Ramie:I never went to a Halloween party, and if I did, it was certainly not that wild. It was so tame, I can't remember it. Yeah, I guess you could call the big event they had on main street a festival of sorts, the fall festival.
Remember, we all dress in Halloween costumes and go up to the main street?
Beth:Yeah. And the hayride in the antique. Well, in the cemetery.
Ramie:I mean, it is antique, so if you count the people.
Beth:In the 19th century, several Us cities tried to make the parties illegal.
Ramie:Good luck with that. That's like prohibition.
Beth:Yeah. People continued having them in secret at that point. Now we're going into the bopping for apples gross tradition, in my opinion.
You might as well go make out or spit food in the mouths of everyone that played before you.
Ramie:Yep.
Beth:It's thought to have originated in Ireland, England, and Scotland. Originally, it was called ducking for apples or apple ducking. It's often played as part of harvest festivals and celebrations.
Ramie:I remember they had this in school earlier years.
Beth:I don't remember ever having this in school. I don't ever remember being around any.
Ramie:Apple popping well, it was like my first, like, pre k kind of thing.
Beth:Or kindergarten where it doesn't matter if you share each other's germs because you're going to be eating each other's boogers. Some versions, the apples would be placed in a tub of water to float.
There's another version, though, where apples would be suspended from a tree branch and tied to a string.
Ramie:I have seen that in tv, and that's the only one I would do.
Beth:Participants would try to jump to get a bite of the apple. I wouldn't do that because it sounds like a great way to pull a tooth. Or I just keep seeing these kids hanging from the apple with their mouth.
Ramie:Fish on a string.
Beth:Yeah, just swinging around.
Ramie:When I was a little kid at the same, I bit into an apple and one of my teeth came out in it.
Beth:Maybe a banana and something nice and mushy.
Ramie:That way it won't be as bad bobbing for bananas.
Beth:The myths and superstitions around apple bobbing. It was believed the game could predict who or when a person would get married. And it likely evolved from the festival of Pomona. The fruits and trees.
One, because of the association with fertility, is likely how it became associated with love and marriage. Apples represent the forbidden fruit as well.
From the Garden of Eden, it was believed the first person to remove an apple would be the first to get married.
Ramie:How sinful.
Beth:Mm hmm. It's also believed that if a person was able to remove an apple without using their hands, they would have good luck in the year to come.
Ramie:How many people have the cheat? It sounds like it's a common thing. Yeah, probably miss Withers had to use her hands again. So much for her garden this year.
Beth:It's also thought that if the first initial of the person you will marry was revealed, if you are successful in catching an apple.
Ramie:How did that work?
Beth:I don't know.
Ramie:Did they have, like, letters? How many people back then could read? When was this?
Beth:I don't know what it was. It's just superstitions and myths that.
Ramie:Okay, so it don't really matter. This is all.
Beth:Yeah, obviously this is superstitions, admits Pooey. It was also thought that how many apples you catch would be how many times you got married.
And I thought, so if you're really good at the game, you get punished with divorces or death of multiple spouses. That's nice. Another is if you buy for apples on Halloween night, you will be able to see the face of your future spouse.
And all you're gonna see is yourself in the reflection of the water.
Ramie:I'm all alone. No one here beside me.
Beth:Or if an unmarried woman slept with an apple under her pillow on Halloween nights, she would dream of her future husband. And that just sounds horribly uncomfortable. And like it would be a terrible night's sleep.
Cause if the princess and the pea was uncomfortable just because of a tiny little pee under her mattress, just imagine the crick in your neck caused by sleeping with a fucking apple under your pillow.
Ramie:Back then, apples weren't as big as they are now.
Beth:It's still not gonna be comfortable.
Ramie:Mm mm. God only knows what they were sleeping on other than the apple. You might be lucky to have that apple.
Beth:It's also thought that you'll have good luck in the coming year if you were the person to catch the most apples. But I think I said that before.
Ramie:Well, yeah, you're not going to starve for the next few days.
Beth:Yeah. There's some myths around Halloween as well. Halloween began as a christian holiday is one.
The roots of Halloween are much older than the christian church, and the christian church realized it would be more successful if it merged existing beliefs and celebrations and festivals into its own calendar. For example, Christmas was originally a pagan holiday to celebrate the winter solstice.
The church co opted the holiday and declared that Jesus was born on December 25. And I really don't know much about all of it, but I've heard that he was born in the summer months.
And then again, I don't know what the weather, seasons, and environments were like back then, either.
Ramie:The calendars weren't even the same back.
Beth:Then, so, yeah, who knows?
Ramie:And it's a different part of the world for us. I don't have a clue what time of year it is right now in the Middle east.
Beth:No idea.
And then also, you have to remember the Pope Gregory third or fifth, whichever one, declaring all Saints day to be celebrated in November instead of in May to coincide with Samhain.
Ramie:I love that name every time I hear it.
Beth:Now, the second myth I have about Halloween is that it was invented by America when obviously it was not. The roots of it has gone back for thousands and thousands of years.
Ramie:Big candy companies trying to get you to spend money. I mean, it might be what it is now, but.
Beth:Yeah, now maybe, but. And the third myth I have is Halloween is associated with devil worship.
This belief probably stems from the early christian views that pagan religions were forms of devil worship.
Ramie:The pope said it's okay in its own way when they turn it into these all Saints day, but they still don't accept it. Speaking of this devil worship situation, remember when we would go and dress up as, I was early teens and you were younger than that? Of course.
Me, mo, and mom would dress up and we'd all dress up and go to the mall and walk around town and everything else, and there would be like six or seven people in the.
Beth:Mall walking around trying to ruin just.
Ramie:Innocent children's Halloween, up to everybody who was dressed up and telling them that you're guaranteeing your child a place in hell. My grandmama cussed them out.
Beth:Yeah, go, grandmama.
Ramie:And we never went with my other aunt. She'd even been worse, I'm sure.
Beth:Oh, yeah, that would have been great. They would have gotten exactly what they deserved.
Ramie:I wouldn't have cared if they.
Beth:It's not your business if you'd have.
Ramie:Had a stand up where people could willingly walk over if they were interested.
Beth:Yeah, but not outright say that children are going to go to hell walking.
Ramie:Up to strangers and telling you that. What?
Beth:And if they are going to go to hell, if that is actually like us, try to say. I do try. I believe I am a Christian. But also I think that God gave you a brain for a reason. Use it.
And I don't want to be a part of any God that sends children to hell for having fun, innocent fun. They're not worshiping Satan. They're going out to get candy. Shut the hell up.
Ramie:You were dressed up as, like, just a normal thing.
Beth:I was dressed up as a bride that year.
Ramie:I was a vampire as always. But you were a bride. I don't know what in the world he. It was a guy that got to us. They were also in Walmart.
I recall handing out tiny bobbles, which, you know, that's. At least they didn't say anything mean. They just gave us a tiny bobble.
Beth:But they also don't mention the fact that christians took the pagan holidays. So are we just not going to mention that or are we just going to. A lot of them don't do it when it's convenient.
Ramie:No, simple as that. It's just, I know a lot of churches have Halloween events now, so. Yeah, but that happened when we were later in our teens, when we were children.
Beth:I was with a friend and we were taking her son around to these churches for trunk or treating, I think is what they call them. And there was supposed to be one at a certain church on the way to the lake, I believe.
And we walk up and there's this loud music and lights flashing, and I. Teenagers and they were having, they called it a rave. And that is just not somewhere you expect a rave to be a Halloween rave.
Ramie:I don't go out chick or treating or anything anymore. So I don't know if they still go around handing out stuff to kids, trying to tell them they're going to hell.
So we might be just talking about old news right now, probably. I hope we are.
Beth:Yeah. Paganism means of the countryside. The word pagan came to be viewed as negative, likely due to the early christian propaganda.
Yeah, that's what, yeah, we just went through that. They didn't see them as equally valid forms of spirituality, but instead as dangerous and evil.
Many people who practice paganism does not believe in devil worship. Believe it or not, most see it as a way to connect with nature and the world around them. How dare they?
Now we're going into the darker side of Halloween. Halloween was always associated closely with death in the underworld. In victorian times, people became fascinated with spiritualism and the occult.
Seances, Ouija boards, they would try to communicate with the dead, so on and so forth in the 19 hundreds. Some historians believed the popularity of horror movies in the early 19 hundreds helped contribute to the dark side of Halloween.
Ramie:It did. How many? Freddie Maas and Jason.
Beth:Yeah. Movies introduced people to new concepts of horror that were just previously unimaginable. All the gore, the guts, the blood. Halloween and death.
Halloween coincided with the end of harvest season, when food stocks were at their lowest, meaning death was a more present danger at that time. Christians would traditionally visit graves and pay respects at that time as well, to deceased loved ones.
Ramie:I might be seeing you soon. If we don't get more grain, get the spare room ready.
Beth:The day of the dead traces back to the Aztecs and also a time to celebrate the loved ones who had passed away. And costumes when it comes to them, people wearing disguises to ward off evil spirits.
In the late 18 hundreds, a new wave of horror stories began to emerge. And it was popularized by authors such as Edgar Allan Poe and Brian Stoker.
Ramie:Bram Stoker, huh? Bram Stoker.
Beth:Why did I put Brian? I think I put Brian for a few. Either that or it fixed itself.
Ramie:It probably did.
Beth:They had stories with dark images of death or undeath or the undead, and had a profound impact on how people viewed Halloween and became associated more with the gore and the horror.
Ramie:I'm kind of fond of the Bram Stoker story. Era of stories. Edgar Allan Poe, Bram Stoker.
Beth:Yeah, I like Edgar Allan Poe.
Ramie:Yeah. Mary Shelley's Frankenstein. And if I had to pick a eighties horror to really enjoy. It's, it's probably Freddy Krueger.
I've always liked Freddy Krueger. I never was afraid of him.
Beth:Freddie's my man.
Ramie:He made me laugh. And then you got, I think that's why I like, then you got movies like Evil Dead and Army of darkness. Those kind of things are my, my jam.
But Jason and Michael Myers bore me to death.
Beth:Well, I mean, we probably like those. And they are our favorites because it's, that's what we grew up on as children, as. That's what we watched.
Ramie:Yeah. Her mother didn't shelter us that way. We eat. We could watch what we want. I watched the first episode of South park when it came out, and Futurama.
Beth:Which, I mean, that's fine if you don't want your children being exposed to that kind of thing. That's understandable. But we turned out fine.
Ramie:How we think we turned out fine.
Beth:I'm a wonderful person. Thank you very much. Mister, some of the creatures that are associated with Halloween, which is.
Ramie:Oh, I would have never guessed.
Beth:Yeah. Which is, they've always been associated with Halloween, and they can be traced back to ancient times.
The early cultures believed witches were women with supernatural powers.
Ramie:Obviously, that's because they were smart enough to know how to cure a proper sickness or something.
Beth:Yeah, they aren't the ones that took a ch, plucked living chicken's anus and put it on a boo boo. They're the ones that actually got some herbs that do help. And then it worked. And then you got burned because it worked.
People believed that witches could help or harm people with magic. Most of the time, they thought the harm part. This belief was perpetrated. Perpetua.
This belief came from the church labeling witches as evil people who consorted with the devil. Many innocent women were persecuted and killed during the witch trials in the middle.
Ramie:Ages because of jealous other townsfolk or some upset supposed doctor didn't like it that they knew better than they did. Or just some husband who said his wife weren't listening to him.
Beth:Yeah.
Ramie:Later on, they get you institutionalized.
Beth:Yeah.
Ramie:And you best not be reading any book.
Beth:No, no. Don't you read it unless it's the Bible. You. You don't get to read books.
Ramie:Matter of fact, when this happened, you might be a little bit sketchy if.
Beth:You can read it all right. Is a woman able to read anyway?
Ramie:Yeah.
Beth:Why?
Ramie:That's pretty much it.
Beth:Explain that. For shame. Who taught you that? Get back in the kitchen. Good times. Not really. I would be in an institution there's.
Ramie:One witch story I really like. It's the Mayfair witches. It's a novel by Anne Rice. I'll add the link to that if you want a nice, spooky New Orleans witching ghosty story.
It's a town that takes place more modern day and in the past. It gives their history as well. And a lot of these witch trials take place in the later part of New Orleans.
So she acts like she's lived there all her life and misses it. She's only been once.
Beth:I've only been once for a week. But the wrong idea. Witches were thought to be more active on Halloween night because they thought that's when they did their.
What is that word I'm looking for?
Ramie:Rituals.
Beth:Rituals, rituals.
Ramie:Witchy. Witchings.
Beth:We're just gonna go with the word rituals. There's another one I was thinking of. Remember the movie Hansel and Gretel?
Ramie:Covens.
Beth:No.
Ramie:Ceremonies.
Beth:No. Okay, we're just gonna go. Rituals.
Ramie:Witches rites. They didn't have any. They got burned.
Beth:Sabbath.
Ramie:Ah, the Sabbath.
Beth:Sabbath. I want to say this may date back to medieval Europe. Witches were associated with the pagan holiday of Beltane.
This was when people would celebrate the coming of summer by lightning, bonfires and dancing around them. Which doesn't make sense to me, because wouldn't it be celebrating fall or winter or something like that?
Ramie:I think it's just supposed to take place in the darkest part of the year and to scare the spirits away with the dancing and the flower. I'm not 100% sure, but I learned it from the Halloween tree movie, so it could be wrong, but a lot of stuff you've said has just been in there, so.
Beth:Yeah, you need to add the movie to the link because I'll go ahead and not buy that one because I want to watch it.
Ramie:Uh, you mean the book or the movie?
Beth:Both.
Ramie:Okay.
Beth:And with witches comes broomsticks. One theory is as to why broomsticks became associated with the witches dates back to the black death.
Ramie:Okay. Why?
Beth:Because people believed witches were to blame for spreading the bubonic plague, among many other things that they decided to blame that were not correct. They believed that witches would fly away on their broomsticks to avoid being caught.
And I have, in my little own thoughts, in reality, they were probably just grabbing their broomsticks because it was close by and they were going to bop their accusers in the head with it. Yeah, and also bop them because they should have been practicing social distancing.
Ramie:I mean, maybe they hear something going on and, like, the meme of today. They just went out to sweep the sidewalk to hear what the neighbors were arguing about.
And then they assumed the argument was caused by the woman next door.
Beth:Another broomstick theory was thought that it was a symbol of fertility and that flying one represented a woman's freedom from traditional gender roles. Oh. Gotta fly away from that kitchen.
It's more likely it became associated with witches, as it was a common household item used most often by the women accused of being witches, which happened to be the poor. And when the book said the poor part, I kept thinking, do rich women not have brooms? Do they just not?
Ramie:No. But the poor people who cleaned their home for them, or the slaves in America who did it, they would.
I guess they never really had a reason to touch a broom.
Beth:Oh, well, that must be nice.
Ramie:I have a roomba. I don't have a reason. I don't remember the last time I touched a broom.
Beth:Same. Oh. Oh, it was yesterday. No, day before yesterday. Around that time. And with the broom, you gotta have a nice pointy hat to match.
Ramie:I don't understand the hat part. I thought everybody wore hats like that back then.
Beth:There are many theories as to how the pointy hat became associated with the witches. None have been proven, obviously.
The first theory is that jewish people were forced to wear pointy hats in medieval Europe as a way to tell them apart from the christians.
And it's thought that these hats began to be associated with the devil worship and witchcraft, as they were worn by people who were persecuted for their beliefs.
Ramie:That's always the case. It's the scarlet letter or your upside down triangle for the gaze by Hitler, or the Star of David by Hitler to jews.
So it happened in Europe again in the forties and thirties. I think Stalin also had a hand at murdering a bunch of jewish people, too.
Beth:I don't know.
Ramie:I'm pretty sure it did.
Beth:The second theory is that the hats were worn by pagans as a way of honoring the horned God, which a God or a goddess that is associated with nature and fertility.
Ramie:You mean pan.
Beth:Fertility? That sounds right. It didn't say the name, it just said the horned God, which was a God or goddess, but, yeah, that sounds right.
I think I've heard that before.
Ramie:He had horns, but he was greek and roman.
Beth:I say a few of them might. Yeah, but the pointy hat may have been thought to be a sign to suggest that women who wore them were somehow related to Satan. Who.
Ramie:That sounds like an easy one to avoid.
Beth:Yeah, who was obviously thought to have horns.
Ramie:You just don't wear a pointy hat.
Beth:Yeah. Get you a nice rounded hat.
Ramie:No idea that there's a point.
Beth:In the early 20th century, archaeologists discovered mummified remains which became known as the witches of Subeshi.
Ramie:I like that name.
Beth:Mummies wore two foot tall pointy hats with wide brims. These mummies did.
Ramie:Okay, I was trying to say. The Egyptians certainly didn't.
Beth:No, the mummies that they found there did. The third theory is that the hats were used to deflect the witch's power back onto her.
It was believed a witch's power came from her head and that the pointy.
Ramie:Hat would reflect her power back onto her. So they were forced onto people more than they wanted to wear them. It sounds like.
Beth:Sounds like.
Ramie:I don't know why a woman will want her witchy powers reflected back on her. Who wants a spell rebound like that?
Beth:Yeah. Cauldrons. It is an important symbol in many pagan traditions. It has been used in witchcraft for centuries.
In the first theory, which is the most popular, cauldrons were a symbol of the goddess c e r r I d w e n. Cerridwen or Cerridwen. Cerridwen.
Ramie:Cerridwen. I don't know.
Beth:It's a welsh goddess of inspiration, wisdom, and rebirth.
Her cauldron was said to be able to grant knowledge and understanding, which I think we need that cauldron at this point in our lives, we need that cauldron.
Well, the story goes that this goddess's cauldron came to be associated with witches because they were believed to have access to her powerful magic through the cauldron. The second theory. The cauldron was originally a symbol of the goddess brigid, or brigid of fire, healing and fertility.
Her sacred fire was often said to be held in a cauldron.
Ramie:A cauldron of fire.
Beth:Yeah. Moving on to black cats. Meow.
Ramie:I got two.
Beth:Mine is being very noisy, you know.
Ramie:Slobber chops. His brother is very loud as well. Mab. Lady cat. The big, fluffy black cat. She don't make a peep. She's just as quiet as can be.
Beth:She makes a peep when I pet her.
Ramie:Yeah. She goes.
Beth:She does not like me.
Ramie:She don't like nobody.
Beth:It's okay. I still force my love upon her.
Ramie:She sleeps at the foot of the bed now, though.
Beth:Aw.
Ramie:She's getting more social as she gets older.
Beth: 's not meowing. From three to:Black cats are thought to be associated with witches because they were often used as familiars or spirit guides who come.
Ramie:Up with these rules.
Beth:Familiars are animals thought to be associated with witches, such as black cats, toads, dogs, bats, and rats. I think owls should be on there, too. Make all the Harry Potter things happen. Dogs wasn't on the Harry Potter list, was it?
Ramie:I never seen a dog running around Hogwarts.
Beth:No. I think they traded dogs for owls.
Ramie:Uh huh. Must not have been a dog person. Never thought of that, did you?
Beth:No. Black cats were feared because they were thought to be able to transform into evil spirits.
It was also believed to be demons that were given to the witches by the devil.
Ramie:Remember our grandpa used to think they would suck the soul out of you if you let them in the room at night with a baby?
Beth:I remember that.
Ramie:Suck your breath out or something. It would just stick its head in your face and eat your air and you'd die.
Beth:I. I think.
I wonder if that had anything to do, because you hear about how cats know if something is wrong with their human and they'll sit on them, and there was something wrong with the baby to begin with, and the cat was just there to comfort it.
Ramie:Yeah, actually, the cat's just there to get warmth off the feverish bodies.
Beth:They were said to assist witches in their endeavors and thought to be a source of the witch's own power.
Ramie:Well, that's putting all your hopes in something that's very unpredictable.
Beth:Yeah. Black cat's association with luck is whether they are thought to be good or bad. Luck depends on the culture and traditions in the United States.
We have a bunch of ignorant people that think black cats crossing your path is considered bad luck.
Ramie:That's Rick.
Beth:I had bad luck long before I had my black cat, thank you very much.
Ramie:When I see a strange black cat cross my path, I don't know if I cross my fingers or something like that, I do something silly.
Beth:You know what I do? I go by kitty, but I don't.
Ramie:Run from it or try to avoid it.
Beth:Kitty.
Ramie:Mainly because when I see them cross my path, I'm driving, and I don't want to take any chances while I'm on the road.
Beth:No, I stop and I'm like, you get a kitty. Cute.
Ramie:I know. If I'm on the. If you come home with me, I'm passing someone's house. I'm not gonna steal their cat.
Beth:Oh, no. If it's at somebody's house, I'm not gonna do that.
Ramie:But I would never just take a cat from somebody.
Beth:Yeah, that's rude. Vampires portrayed in books, movies, and tv shows over the years, such as Bram Stoker's Dracula and Rice's Vampire Chronicles.
Ramie:Also the Twilight saga, if you're into that, but I'm more of a vampire Chronicles guy. They have a new series on AMC. Also, it's on HBO for a short while, I think. Or maybe that's the witching hour. Both of them ran Rice.
I'll add the first book of the Vampire chronicles in here, too.
Beth:Well, I only read interview with the vampire.
Ramie:I would add it in Bram Stoker's Dracula, but if you want to read that, no joke, it's free to read. You can get it anywhere. It's out of the public domain now.
Yeah, but Anne Ross's and them, you'll probably have to pay for or get a subscription to something. I don't think they're on Kindle Unlimited, though.
Beth:Really?
Ramie:No, Beth, like the big authors, a lot of their books don't show up on unlimited. Some of them do, but some don't, so.
Beth:Oh, okay. So, I mean, you can still purchase.
Ramie:Them on Kindle, though, but if you have unlimited date, like, free.
Beth:Yeah, okay. I get what you're saying.
They were thought to have originated in eastern Europe in the 18th century, but evidence shows that belief in vampires dates back much further in ancient cultures such as Sumerians, Babylonians, and Assyrians. All have had stories of blood drinking demons.
Ramie:I'm pretty sure the evil dead demons were from Samaria.
Beth:Yeah. In medieval Europe, there were many reports of people becoming vampires after their deaths.
They were thought to have come from consumption victims who showed signs of being undead, such as having reddish complexions and bleeding from the mouth.
Ramie:Ah, yes, consumption. The romantics disease.
Beth:Yeah.
In the 18th century, eastern Europe, people took drastic measures to prevent themselves from becoming a vampire after death, such as driving spikes through the corpse's heart, stuffing their mouths with rocks, and burning them.
Ramie:I mean, if everybody's got consumption, burning them isn't the worst idea.
Beth:Yeah.
er's dracula was published in: Ramie:If you want to go to a good movie, that's kind of funny, watch Dracula dead. Loving it. Yeah, it's a Dracula comedy. It's basically Dracula, but funny.
Beth:And bats, which also are associated with vampires and rabies. And rabies.
Ramie:And adorable little flying mammals.
Beth:They are adorable, but I don't trust them.
Ramie:I don't trust rabies.
Beth:That's why I don't trust them. I don't like shots, and I will do everything I possibly can to prevent getting one.
Ramie:I had to go catch a bat in your house one time, and it tried to bite me.
Beth:Yeah. That's why I made you do it.
Ramie:It almost got through my leather glove.
Beth:It is your job as the big brother to do the bat catching.
Ramie:I was like, I don't know what to do with it. So I set it in a cage for a while until that night, and I turned it loose because it was morning when I picked it up.
Beth:Yeah.
Ramie:And I sat there thinking, oh, God, I hope it didn't get through the glove.
Beth:See, all I saw were, my walls are the same color as the bat. I looked up and I saw. I was like, is my wall molding with some funny colored mold?
And I got up closer to it and I'm like, oh, shit, it's a bat that decided to go to sleep in my house.
Ramie:How did it get in?
Beth:They had had the door open while they were working on that box I used to put trash in so that the animals won't get into it. And they just left the door open, and it was starting to get dark. And all I can figure is it came in during that time.
Ramie:It just flew around the house while you slept that night? Yeah, just had free raid of the house. It's a wonder all your cats didn't get rabies. It is, but I guess it's living a perfectly fine life now.
Yeah, unless it died of rabies or something afterwards, because I hope it didn't have it then. Otherwise I'd be dead.
Beth:Yeah. See? You're fine.
Ramie:It's been a year ago.
Beth:Creatures of the night. Creatures of the night.
Ramie:What a mess they make.
Beth:They're seen as sinister and spooky. And the word vampire comes from the slavic word for bat. I don't know what it is because the book didn't say that and I didn't look it up.
Is Russian the same as slavic?
Ramie:Yeah, Beth, there's a lot of slavic countries. Ukraine, for instance.
Beth:Okay. I have no idea because it's only showing the scribbles that I can't read called russian Alphabet. I have no idea.
Ramie:Go on.
Beth:So we'll just skip past that. It's thought that the association vampires and bats in Halloween likely began because they are nocturnal creatures.
Some also feed on blood, and they are proficient flyers, which may have made them seem otherworldly to the early humans.
Ramie:Who aren't familiar with the concept of sonar.
Beth:Moving on to ghosts.
Ramie:Another classic.
Beth:Mhm. Belief in ghosts dates back for thousands of years. It can be found in cultures around the world.
Early cultures believed ghosts were harmful spirits that caused diseases and death. And some believed that they could possess people's bodies and control their actions.
Ramie:I'd imagine seizures had a lot to do with that. Or people just not wanting to be caught doing bad things. Yeah, I didn't mean to do it. The ghosty aunt. Dude, Myrtle did it.
Beth:And spiders. In many cultures, spiders are seen as creatures of the underworld. They can forethought to bring illness or bad luck.
And if it's the right kind of spider and it bites you, it can bring illness and bad luck, which you're gonna think is bad luck.
Ramie:My fingers falling off.
Beth:They were also thought to be able to cast spells. But in other cultures, spiders are seen as helpful and weave webs to catch pests.
Ramie:That's how I see them.
Beth:That's how I see them.
Ramie:I'll let them run rampant.
Beth:And they're also considered a symbol of good luck in those other cultures.
Ramie:I caught one today under the bed that was a bit too large for my comfort.
Beth:And see, I don't care if they're large, but I've been finding baby brown recluses in my house and I just can't be living like that.
Ramie:I think you're a little imagining things.
Beth:I'm not. They have fiddles on their back. I make sure. And I just can't be living like that. And I wish my other little pet spiders would do their jobs.
That I keep around and kill these little bastards. All because I like my skin. I want to keep my skin because that brings me to my next topic, actually. Zombies. I like my skin. I want to keep it.
Ramie:If all these brain were closest, I began to wonder if you had a brain.
Beth:Zombies were first mentioned in 17th or 18th century accounts of voodoo rituals. They were thought to be slaves in these stories.
Ramie:Yeah, they weren't quite the undead.
Beth:It's believed that they had been resurrected by a powerful sorcerer. And zombies are said to be immune to pain, unable to think, and unable to feel emotions.
Over time, the idea of zombies spread to other countries where they became a staple of horror films and stories. Now video games as well, because left four deads. They're my favorites.
I like the second one because I like the New Orleans cemetery themes and swamps.
Ramie:Yeah, that was fun.
Beth:Why do zombies eat brains?
Ramie:Do we know?
Beth:Well, considering I've never encountered a zombie and there's probably no chance of them actually being real? Probably not. But some believe zombies are driven by a basic instinct to consume any living thing they could find.
Others believe zombies eat brains because they are seeking out the food that is most rich in nutrients. But how in the world do you know if brains are most nutrient?
Ramie:I don't know. I've only seen a few brains. It's usually when my daddy would kill a deer or something and that one of his horns.
Beth:Did you eat them?
Ramie:No, I probably poked him with a stick. I was a child.
Beth:There's also the memories theory. Some think that zombies are attracted to the memories and thoughts in the people's brains because they lost their own memories.
Sounds like a good plan to me.
Ramie:Mm hmm. I'm just gonna take yours. Please.
Beth:Yeah, you probably got better ones than.
Ramie:I do anyway, at least up until this point.
Beth:You did anyway, ain't you? And you're gonna have the memory of you getting eaten or of you eating that person, but it's gonna be their memory that you have.
Ramie:Carl from fifth street. Two stars.
Beth:Ancient Greeks may have been the first civilization to fear the undead. Archaeologists have found many ancient graves which contain skeletons that were pinned down with rocks and other heavy objects.
And when it comes to the voodoo, some believe zombies are people, revived by a voodoo practitioner known as boker. Bokers are said to use herbs, shells, fish bones, and other animal parts and other objects to create concoctions which contain tetrodotoxin.
It's the neurotoxin that's found in pufferfish. I don't know how to pronounce it, but that's what it is, and it's very deadly. If that's why you have to, I believe, have a license to prepare it.
Ramie:I would never eat any.
Beth:Yeah. If used carefully at sublethal doses, it may cause zombie like symptoms such as difficulty walking, mental confusion, and respiratory problems.
Ramie:Oh, great. Sounds like a party. Let's have some tetradotoxin.
Beth: A:In Haiti, a woman appeared dead and was buried in a family tomb, and she reappeared three years later.
Ramie:Ah, lucky her.
Beth:Yeah. And then. I don't know how to say this guy's name. Also in Haiti. Kervius.
Ramie:I guess.
Beth:Narcisse.
Ramie:That's a cool name.
Beth: In:But 18 years later, a man walked up to Angelina Narcisse, which was his sister, claiming to be her brother, Clairvias. The townspeople and family members identified him as such, and he claimed he had been buried alive, dug up, and put to work on a sugar plantation.
Ramie:Doesn't sound surprising.
Beth:No. No, it doesn't.
Ramie:1960.
Beth:It sounds like something that would probably happen these days.
Ramie:I'm pretty sure zombies show up in a way, in the Anne Ross witching hour novel as well.
Beth:Yeah. And a few other interesting notes before we end this episode.
Russia doesn't celebrate Halloween and is vocal about why it is not welcome in their country. Some politicians and religious groups say it goes against their cultural and christian values and traditions.
Ramie:Okay.
Beth:After the Watergate scandal, the Nixon mask became more popular for Halloween costumes, and this caused more stores to start selling masks of other politicians. Face is.
Ramie:Yeah. The Trump Obama masks, and I've seen them.
Beth:Scarecrows symbolize the ancient agricultural roots of the holiday Halloween.
Ramie:Never knew that. I just thought they were to scare away crows. Batman villain.
Beth:Also a nice place to put the bad people in. Doctor who.
Ramie:Oh, yeah, I forgot about him. The family.
Beth:Yeah. Tampering with candy.
Most of the cases about tampering with candy have been debunked, but it has caused panic about people putting razors or poison in kids candy for Halloween. A couple of cases that I found actually turned out to be true.
In: Ramie:Oh, wow.
Beth:Yeah. So that wasn't even a stranger. That was the parents.
Ramie:Yeah.
Beth: And in:He had not long before gotten a life insurance policy out on his son, so it made it very obvious to try to make it look more like a random stranger did it, though. He also laced his daughter's candy and the candy of three other kids.
His daughter and the other kids didn't end up eating the candy, but his son obviously did, and he died from the poison.
Ramie:What would be the point of trying to collect life insurance if he didn't?
Beth:Yeah, but still.
And in there was this one bitch who didn't like giving candy to older kids or teenagers, so she gave them steel wool pads, dog biscuits, and poison tablets. From what I can understand. She said it wasn't edible, but I think it was the ant poison tablets that probably really did her in.
Ramie:Mm hmm.
Beth:And I couldn't find where any kids actually ate them, but she was charged. And in my own little thoughts, I say she probably could have gotten away with it if it hadn't been for the ant poison.
I would have enjoyed getting everyday cleaning supplies and such so that I wouldn't have to buy them myself. So bring on the tide pods.
Ramie:Some written in stranger gave my grandma a case of beer when he realized she was dressed up for two. Yeah, also some woman gave me a cat. My mama was upset.
Beth:I want a cat. And then we got electric blankets as well. But yeah, bring on the tide pods for older people because laundry detergent is expensive these days.
But seriously though, why get pissed about teenagers trick or treating instead of them going out and partying and drinking, getting into trouble and destroying property?
Ramie:Yeah, next year they won't go trick or treat and they'll just toilet paper your house.
Beth:Yeah.
But I also decided to add a little list of not normal things that I would enjoy getting for Halloween that's not candy cleaning supplies because they're expensive and I don't want to buy them myself. Soap, shampoos and hygiene self care products and office supplies like pens, pencils, paper, notebooks, things like that.
The cat and that's all I have for today. I think that's been long enough and I'm tired and I got schoolwork to do.
Ramie:I'll add a few links to things in the description, affiliate links from Amazon for the books and some of the movies we might have talked about. Also some trial subscriptions to Prime Kindle Unlimited, stuff you might want to try since they're affiliate links.
Associate links is what they call them. If you use them, we will get a little piece of that sale, and it's only just to help us out.
It ain't going to raise the price on you to give it to us or anything. Also, if you like what you heard here, we have a few other podcasts. We have leveling duo.
It's a podcast for me and my friend Dakota talk about video games we really enjoy. And we have brother Nurse Quest.
It's a podcast where I tell Beth about random tabletop role playing games that I pull off my shelf and don't get to play. So I want to talk to her about them. She tells me if she likes them at the end or don't. All the links I talk about that are oh, sorry.
We also have a bunch of social links like TikTok, Twitter, Instagram. Beth has an email to contact her. We have a YouTube channel. All those links, including the website link to our general podcast website.
If you want to go there, you could donate there if you really want to, but I recommend using affiliate links so you can buy something nice for yourself and help us just look at the episodes and find something like. But all that is in the link tree link.
The first link you come to in the description of this episode and all the affiliate links will be right below that. We are part of the podcast network gruesome gaming group.
So if you see gruesome gaming or GGG on any of those links, that is the ones for all of our podcasts, but you can get ahold of them and follow all of our stuff from there. It's the easiest way to see everything all at once if you want to keep track of what we're doing or contact me or Beth.
If you send an email to Beth on the email link, it will just go straight to her. So if you have any ideas for the show, it's been really fun learning some of the stuff about Halloween.
I hope we haven't insulted too many cultures or religions and I guess that's it.
Beth:I've been raving and I'm Beth.
Ramie:Thank you for listening to h h. Bye bye.
